梅根·凯利：离开 NBC 与独立媒体的崛起

Speaker 1 (00:00:00): Well, Megyn Kelly looks to be parting ways with NBC. Her show is now canceled. Megyn Kelly (00:00:05): Megyn Kelly just landed a new gig. Why was she given a platform in the first place? We're doing this program because we believe there's an urgent need for independent voices in the media landscape. Speaker 3 (00:00:16): I know the audience you have. I can reasonably guess it. It's enormous. Podcast, Rumble, YouTube, Twitter with Elon, that's the problem. A lot of people in cable news, Megan, are fighting Jason Calacanis (00:00:35): Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Megyn Kelly. Cheah, great to see you. Thank you for coming. Hi. Thanks for being here. Alright. Yeah. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:00:48): Hi, Megan. Alright. Jason Calacanis (00:00:49): Nice to meet you. David Sacks (00:00:50): Hey, Megan. How are you? Jason Calacanis (00:00:51): Did you get to hear Peter Thiel, Megan? Megyn Kelly (00:00:54): I did. Just the tail end. Just a bit. Jason Calacanis (00:00:56): What do you think of Peter? Megyn Kelly (00:00:57): He's brilliant. Jason Calacanis (00:00:58): Yeah? David Sacks (00:00:59): Yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:00:59): I mean, thank God for him. Right? It's like there's a few guys in tech with a lot of money keeping Republican candidates alive, and we need every single one of Jason Calacanis (00:01:06): them. Okay. Thank you golly. Starting early. David Friedberg (00:01:11): I think all of them were here today. Jason Calacanis (00:01:19): You seem incredibly, happy as an independent broadcaster and running your own show. Maybe, number 1, am I right that you're just absolutely engaged and excited again about broadcasting? Because it seemed like the tail end of your working for the machine was particularly challenging. Oh, yeah. Tell us Megyn Kelly (00:01:42): That's a polite way Jason Calacanis (00:01:42): of saying it. I'm trying to be polite. Yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:01:44): No. It's fine. Yeah. Jason Calacanis (00:01:45): You are? Well, the last time you kinda David Friedberg (00:01:47): rule out one of them. Hold them a prick on on TV. Megyn Kelly (00:01:50): I do. I do. It was it was good natured. David Friedberg (00:01:53): It was good nature. Yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:01:54): Tell me, Gary. I'm so I'm so much happier, and it's really changed my whole view on on cancel culture. You know? I really I'm a believer in cancel culture now. I think it separates individuals from companies where they do not belong, that where the values are not aligned. And I really can't imagine being right now at NBC or frankly at Fox News in this environment and having to come port with their rules on how we talk about these very dicey issues that are all over the news today. I I could not do it. It was just a matter of time before I was canceled. Jason Calacanis (00:02:26): Yeah. Talk about producing a show now that is the largest. You're you're now the largest broadcaster in in the news category on YouTube, crushing everybody else. CNN, Fox, their YouTube channels, now bow down before you, and you are an independent company with, I understand, 6 people. Megyn Kelly (00:02:46): Yeah. 6 producers. Jason Calacanis (00:02:48): Six producers. So that is how many people at the peak, NBC, Fox, did you have working in your group? Megyn Kelly (00:02:55): Well, I probably had about 15 producers, but Fox is always lean. CNN, the Anderson Cooper show, which was, you know, across from us for a while, minus 1 hour, had something like a 100 staffers. So think about it. So we did not in July, we did not beat CNN, but we had 2 thirds of CNN's YouTube audience. 2 thirds. Every single dollar in the multibillion dollar CNN audience went into, obviously, their live broadcast, which we crush. We crush their numbers, you know, dollar to dollar in terms of, like, the podcast and so on. But let's just look at YouTube. So all those resources go into their YouTube feed as well, and it's got every show on CNN, every single talent. And our one show with my 6 producers crushed the well, came close to crushing them all and did crush CBS and NBC, which was a particularly nice, easy news. Jason Calacanis (00:03:42): When you left, my understanding of these deals when Tucker left on Lemon, and you leave those broadcast ones, it's kind of, like, they're paying you to not compete. You can't go work for another network. So were was that the case with you if you can say it, and and then you were kind of forced to become an independent broadcaster? Megyn Kelly (00:04:01): I wasn't forced. I was only forced to have my show end at NBC. And beyond that, I don't think I'm at liberty to speak of these specifics. But, I was free to get another job. I just wasn't sure I would. There was a couple of years there that were dark and depressing, and my industry is incredibly disgusting and toxic and awful. Perhaps you've watched the news and you know. And I just sat on the couch thinking, why would I go back into that? That was terrible, and it makes you a bad person and unhappy. And all they do is stimulate outrage all the time and then get rich off of it, and you have to push somebody else's agenda, and I don't wanna do any of that. And it wasn't until the first, the pandemic hit, and then, you know, we started to lose our minds on all the mandates, and then George Floyd, and then we really lost our minds. And seeing those people in the streets trying to make people put down their burgers and say black lives matter is when I got up off my couch and said, now it's on. Like, I I can't stand when people make me do things. I really I I can't stand bullies, and it's in my DNA to stand up against them. And so I had to get back on the air. And I said to my therapist, who is really underpaid, what if nobody watches? Jason Calacanis (00:05:23): You know? What if nobody listens? Megyn Kelly (00:05:24): It was just a podcast at the time. No visual. And, he's from South Africa, and he said, well, I'll listen. I said, okay. Great. He said, and Doug will listen, my husband. I'm like, well, I got 2. And that was 4 years ago, and now it's going great. Jason Calacanis (00:05:39): How has your approach changed, if at all, in terms of what you want to produce and what conversations you want to have? Because you no longer have to think, well, what is Roger Ells think or this NBC person or or everybody in between? You you actually, the buck stops at your desk, at your microphone. You are the decider now. So how what what is your framework for deciding what to put on air? Because you do also now, suffer from, hey, you're in YouTube. If it bleeds, it's lead it leads. If it has rage associated with it, it's gonna get more clicks. So how do you mitigate that, you know? Megyn Kelly (00:06:16): Well, I I love my producers and a few of them have been with me for over 10 years, 15 years plus from Fox News, from the earliest show I ever did in 2007 to now. So they know me very well, and they know what lights my fire. And if I feel that fire in the belly, it's usually not outrage. It's just fire in the belly over the news. Then it's a good story for me, and that differs host to host. You know, what what drives you nuts? What what do you need to have your say on? And so for me, speaking of therapists, it's like therapy to go out there on the set and say what I know is true. Right? Just say what's true about the news, and then we can argue about the meaning and our opinions on what's true. But what's true should not be so up for debate. But, yeah, I have a few through lines that my team always knows will get me excited. And since the beginning, free speech has been one of them. And the thing about the cops, it's not coincidental that that's what got me up because I've been at Fox, you know, 14 years I was there, and I have a brother who's a police officer. He he's a retired lieutenant and one of the most honorable men you'll ever meet in your life. And I am just so sick and have been so sick of the lies that have been told about cops. Jason Calacanis (00:07:22): It's brutal. We we have law enforcement in my family as well, and it's really hard to watch this. Yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:07:28): Yes. It's so egregious. This is not to excuse the few bad apples that you see on the news, but they are so not representative of your average police officer. Jason Calacanis (00:07:35): Absolutely not. Megyn Kelly (00:07:35): And it's these guys make no money. You know, they they don't get a lot of glory. Jason Calacanis (00:07:39): They risk their lives. Megyn Kelly (00:07:40): They risk their lives every day for us. Right? And now on top of all that, they're treated like absolute shit by everyone. The news media, absolutely no qualms about ruining these guys' lives before any due process. And that's what the media has been doing with everyone in the past 5 years. No due process. You are you're accused of anything. You're guilty. And there's really no Jones to figure out whether it's fair. And so, you know, given my legal background, because I practice law for a decade, that's another piece of it that always gets me fired up. Somebody being unfairly railroaded. Jason Calacanis (00:08:11): I think the topic you've been most on fire, and I I think it's very brave, is the issues around, trans issues, trans rights, and maybe young children. You're not a bigot, but you're being framed as that when this discussion comes up. Maybe you could explain just what is your position on biological men in locker rooms, you know, and and maybe kids receiving hormones or having their bodies mutilated because they maybe feel like they're the opposite gender. I don't wanna lead the witness here, but I think we're more in sync on this issue than maybe most. Megyn Kelly (00:08:52): Yeah. I don't care what they call me. They can call me a bigot, a terf, a transmisogynist, which is not a thing. I will speak truth. Men cannot become women. Period. Women can't become men either, And men and boys do not belong in women's spaces, whether it's a bathroom, a locker room, or a sports event. They don't. And good men do not wish to access those places. And, by the way, even if you have some empathy for someone who's genuinely struggling, the problem is the camel's nose. Because as soon as you allow one person who may be genuinely struggling with this issue into your 17 year old girl's locker room, that opportunity will be exploited by openly bad actors. And when girls start getting hurt in these private spaces as they already have been, listen to Riley Gaines' testimonial about what happened to her with Leah Thomas about how he was in there. He was looking at her. She was naked. She had no idea an intact male was entering her locker room. The humiliation she felt, that counts as injury, but we could go well beyond that because it's crossed over to actual physical. So I am willing to fight to my dying day against that without judging trans people themselves. What you do in the privacy of your own home or your own life is your business, not mine, unless you make it my business, and then you will hear from me. And if you make it my child's business, times 10. Jason Calacanis (00:10:17): And in your answer, is empathy for somebody who is suffering from gender dysmorphia, and and who's struggling with that issue, and you don't have a problem with those individuals as you said 2 or 3 times in that one answer. Yet, you could give that disclaimer. You could say you have empathy or sympathy for them, and the only thing they're gonna hear is, you know, something they project into it. Megyn Kelly (00:10:43): So it got a lot easier for me on the name calling in response to this issue once I realized the vast majority of people who wanna call me a bigot or a terf are men. They are men posing as women. So these are men trying to shame me out of standing up for my daughter and myself and my fellow women on our safe spaces. It's that's the end of it. They can take a seat because these men don't know the first thing. They're showing up for, for mammograms. You ladies know what it's like, the older ones like me, sitting in the mammogram office where you're out there waiting to go in and you're in the your little robe and you're worried. You're nervous. You gotta do it when you hit a certain age. You're but you're you know what you're there for. You guys have it on the other end. Yeah. You're like, I I hope I don't have cancer. They say I need to go here. I gotta find it early. You're sitting looking at other women, and now we're having men. Men sneak in there not because they're actually worried because a very, very small percentage can get but because they wanna feel like women. Same thing at the OBGYN. Get out. Get out of our spaces. I'm sick of this bullshit. What I want have empathy for is us, women and girls. Somebody else can worry about the feelings of the men Jason Calacanis (00:11:48): who wanna ask them. They're having. Can I David Friedberg (00:11:54): do you think that there are individuals who have been historically repressed and have now felt the freedom to come out and say that they are a different gender? Or do you think that there's something else socially going on? What's what's what's going on, and and, you know, why do you think that this has become such a prominent issue of late in the last couple Chamath Palihapitiya (00:12:16): of years? Megyn Kelly (00:12:16): 100%. It has exploded as a social contagion, and that's been documented by many people from very smart woman at Brown to Abigail Shrier and her must read book, Irreversible Damage and Beyond. But this is a social contagion. This is not populating in the way that it is just because we're more accepting now. And if that were true, you would see it everywhere. But what you're seeing it is more concentrated in more leftist states, cities, regions. And that's because the more of it kids are exposed to, the more they gravitate toward it. And in that way, it is like anorexia. I just had Kelly j Keane in a pre taped show today. She's airing tomorrow. She's an activist on this issue. And she was saying if you go on YouTube and you Google anorexia or bulimia, they won't show you the videos. But if you Google top surgery, which is the super sweet way of saying a double mastectomy, usually for 15 or 14 year old girls, you can see all you want all day long. And what's happening more and more is autistic children or children someplace on the spectrum stumble on to this, and in many cases have obsessive thinking to begin with, and go down a rabbit hole that takes them hours on end down Reddit or one of these other websites. And it does become an obsessive thought and then obsessive behavior. And then you have a medical community that has submitted to affirm. The standard is affirm. Not, are your parents going through a divorce? Did you have really bad grades? Was there a sexual assault in your past, which is so often the case for a lot of the young girls in particular? No. You're not even allowed to go there or you're considered engaging in conversion therapy. It's crossover. That's it. Puberty blockers, cross sex hormones. Those two things alone in that order, high, high likelihood you are sterile. You are sterilizing yourself and your parents are allowing it. Just puberty blockers into cross sex hormones. That's it. Never mind chopping off body parts. Megyn Kelly (00:14:10): And then they'll go to school and they'll say I'm no longer a girl, and the school will hide it from the people who love that child most, their parents, if the parents aren't on the affirm board. In New York City, where I fled with my children because they were trying to do this to our schools and our classes, that's the that's the policy, private and public. You do not tell the parents. It's a secret. What kind of country are we getting to be where we allow secrets between grown teachers and minors that the parents aren't allowed to know? That's what we used to call grooming. Right? It opens up a very dangerous door. David Friedberg (00:14:48): And why has this become politicized, and how has it become politicized? Megyn Kelly (00:14:53): That I don't understand. I don't understand how, frankly, anyone can vote Democrat right now. I just don't get it. I know that there's a priority of issues. Right? And some for some people, it's Jason Calacanis (00:15:07): Oh, David's here. You just woke up. For some people, David Friedberg (00:15:12): I democrat. What? Megyn Kelly (00:15:15): It it's abortion or it's, you know, I can't think of the issues that would make you vote democrat even though I used to vote democrat. I'm a registered independent. I voted in 8 presidential elections. I voted democrat 4 times and republican 4. I'm about as independent as you can get. David Sacks (00:15:29): Let me can we let's shift gears to the election then. So, Jason Calacanis (00:15:33): yeah. You peaked his interest. I didn't David Sacks (00:15:35): think that was gonna be funny, but so, Megan, I mean, in addition to being a great broadcaster, you actually are a great, political pundit, I would say, and prognosticator. I remember being on your show at the beginning of the Republican primary when DeSantis was riding high making the case for DeSantis. Obviously, that was totally wrong. And you're like, no. You know? Like, it's gonna be Trump. You know? The Republican party is not done with Trump, and you are exactly right. Do you what's your take on where things are at right now? And do you do you have a take on who's gonna win? Megyn Kelly (00:16:05): I mean, of course, we all wanna know that. Right? That's why we follow these polls religiously because we wanna peek into what's gonna happen. I mean, I think Trump right now is better positioned to win than he's ever been in any election before. If you look at where he is, let's take the New York Times Sienna poll that just dropped. That's the gold standard. That's the best poll if you ask most pollsters. Huge sample and likely voters, and it's got Trump up 1, which is basically a tie. Up 1. This time, 4 years ago, Biden was up 9 over Trump, and that election was this tight. And it had Biden up 9. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:16:40): It said the statistical probability of an electoral college for Trump was 99.7%. Megyn Kelly (00:16:45): Yep. If you look the swing states, David Friedberg (00:16:47): it's got to say interpretation of that poll. Yeah. That came out to yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:16:51): And Nate now the left is turning on Nate, inexplicably, really. I mean, other than his data. But they loved Nate, and they created Nate. But now that Nate's numbers aren't going their way, they're like, who's Nate connected to? Who's he working for? Nate, like most prognosticators, wants to be right. But look. I'll say this. And by the way, in 16, it showed Hillary up 2 at this point. So and Trump won that election. You know, the general wisdom is that the Democrat has to be up some 4 points or better in the national polling given the fact that they usually win the popular vote, give just given how blue the urban centers are in order to win, in order to cross over in those swing states. And right now, she's not I mean, that New York Times poll shows her downward. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:17:34): You were in the middle of the 2016 election. I find this comparison very interesting, so I'm curious your take. Contrast and compare Donald Trump versus Hillary Clinton what day is it today? September 9th of that election, and Donald Trump and Kamala Harris September 9th now. Megyn Kelly (00:17:56): Trump had some advantages back then that he doesn't have now, including his genuine outsider status. It was very attractive to a lot of voters who had never voted before, speaking of getting up off your couch. That really worked for him. And Trump was incredibly vibrant, feisty, fiery, fun, you know, provocative, obviously controversial, and knew. You know, we all knew Trump, but we knew him as this crazy New York's bit businessman with a lot of color, and suddenly he morphed under the political field, like, un unlike anything we'd ever seen. I mean, there was a reference to penis size in a presidential debate. Yeah. I was there. So that happened. This time around, people are a little bit more used to Trump's bits, right, his routine. He's obviously a little older, but still vibrant. I mean, could any of you have stood on that presidential stage and given a nearly 2 hour address a week after someone shot you in the ear? Like, I was falling asleep, and I was seated and fine. You know? I'm like, I didn't mean so he's got a lot of energy, but he's not an outsider exactly anymore. He's he is still one. He's not taking, like, all the money these fat cats and ready to kiss their bottoms necessarily, but he's lost that. What he's gained is a record. You know, now Trump can go on this debate stage tomorrow night with some real ammo. You know, if you were you better off 4 years than you are today, and can really point to his policies. And one of the great tragedies of the Trump era has been his policies have been incredibly good for America. Yeah. It's just his rhetoric is so Toxic. Interesting. Divisive. Yeah. Toxic? Depends on who you ask. Right? Depends on who you ask. That he Activating. That the majority of Americans dislike him. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:19:48): And then what about Hillary versus Kamal? Megyn Kelly (00:19:51): Oh god. Well, Hillary was smart. David Sacks (00:20:01): They didn't they didn't hide Hillary. Hillary did interviews. Right? Chamath Palihapitiya (00:20:05): I I had yeah. I had this conversation just this morning. You can say what you want about Hillary Clinton, but she is incredibly competent. Yeah. Incredibly competent. Megyn Kelly (00:20:14): She's competent, and she could have done the job. How she did it and with what level of honesty and corruption would be a different story. But I I really think the problem for Kamala Harris is she's not smart. She's not a deep thinker. She's very surface level. Yes. She's giggling just like that Jason Calacanis (00:20:32): all the time. Feisty. Megan, tell us how you feel. Really. Be honest. Megyn Kelly (00:20:42): And it's a cover. It's an obvious cover. Right? It's like she gets to the point where she doesn't know what she's saying. Even she doesn't know what she's Jason Calacanis (00:20:49): saying, and it's like, Megyn Kelly (00:20:51): ah. And so you feel uncomfortable watching her, and then she gave her first interview to CNN. And suddenly, if that's drunk Kamala, suddenly we're dealing with hungover Kamala. Like, my values haven't changed. Like, clearly, somebody had told her, you cackle, we're out of here. Jason Calacanis (00:21:09): Yeah. Right? What did you think about her bringing her emotional support white guy? Megyn Kelly (00:21:14): Exactly. Her emotional support governor? He was her big white blankie. Like, I understand that. Jason Calacanis (00:21:19): Like, it seemed like a terrible strategic decision. Like, who's making the decision to do that? Megyn Kelly (00:21:23): I objected to the whole thing. I think he was there for 2 two purposes. One was, yes, in case she got in real trouble, he could step in. Jason Calacanis (00:21:31): Yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:21:32): And the other was to suck up some of the airtime so she had a couple of fewer questions to answer. Jason Calacanis (00:21:37): What did you think of the job just broadcasted or broadcasted Dana Bash did? Because she she did ask some tough questions. She did probe a little bit. Megyn Kelly (00:21:44): No. Not enough? She did terribly. Okay. Jason Calacanis (00:21:49): I mean, I don't I don't think it was Megyn Kelly (00:21:50): particularly hard, Jason Calacanis (00:21:51): but Megyn Kelly (00:21:51): But that was not a good job. Jason Calacanis (00:21:53): Okay. Explain why. What would you have done differently? Megyn Kelly (00:21:55): So many things. Go back and listen to my podcast the day after because I just took it apart forensically bit by bit. Jason Calacanis (00:22:00): Give us the top 3 here. Megyn Kelly (00:22:01): There where were the follow-up questions? Where were the hard hitting follow ups when she said her nonsense? Like, specifically, how? What exactly caused you to change your mind? Walk me through the process. And hit her with all of them, not just a couple. And Tim Walz, grammar? The grammar excuse? That's why he said he carried a weapon into war. It was his grammar? What kind of BS was that? Jason Calacanis (00:22:24): And no follow-up. Yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:22:25): Yes. And, honestly, all I've taken was Yeah. Do you really want our audience to believe you said you took weapons into war as a soldier? Okay? Because every every actual service personnel knows you don't exaggerate something like that. That's hallowed ground. You don't say you went to war when you didn't. And he's already on the hot seat for having said, you know, he was a command sergeant major, and he he didn't retire such and so on. Anyway, all it would have taken was, you really want this audience to believe that was a grammatical error? Is that your story? No. That she none of that was done. And it was just irritating because there's so much for Kamala Harris to be cross examined on, and she just she went to sleep. Jason Calacanis (00:23:04): I mean, in the follow-up and the follow-up question is just such an easy thing to do. You don't even have to say it as aggressively as you did. You just say, okay. So to be clear, let me repeat back to you. Grammar Yes. Is the reason you said this. Megyn Kelly (00:23:15): Let me tell you something. Let me tell you something. Some aggression was warranted. This is the problem. Her her timidity is part of the problem because I I challenge anybody. Go back and look. I did an interview with Trump in September. We've been through a lot, he and Chamath Palihapitiya (00:23:29): I. Jason Calacanis (00:23:30): Well, yeah. Yeah. That that's an interesting relationship. Megyn Kelly (00:23:33): It's a very interesting relationship. And I saw him at a Turning Point event the previous August, and I said, I'd love to sit down with you. He said, great. I'll do it. So we sat down September of last year. It was a great interview. It was challenging. He was not in love with it. Jason Calacanis (00:23:48): Good. Which part? Megyn Kelly (00:23:50): Where I hammered him on the legal stuff. Jason Calacanis (00:23:53): Yeah. Megyn Kelly (00:23:53): It had a crescendo and a decrescendo like every good interview should. You know, we started up off with some stuff that he would like. Joe Biden's old. How about that? And then you built. Jason Calacanis (00:24:02): You warmed him up. It's a classic strategy. Right? David Sacks (00:24:04): So on on on the on the legal on the lawfare, so judge Marchand just moved the sentencing date from I guess it's supposed to be a few days ago to November 18th. It occurs to me that's 2 weeks after the election. So if Mershon wants to send Trump to prison but is afraid to do it now because it'd be a huge backlash for the election, seems to me that's kinda what you do. You set the date 2 weeks after. Do you I mean, what's your take on that? Do you think David Friedberg (00:24:30): gets elected when he David Sacks (00:24:31): If Trump lose the election, do you think he's going to Rikers? Megyn Kelly (00:24:34): No. I don't. David Sacks (00:24:34): You don't think so? Megyn Kelly (00:24:35): I think there's a possibility Marshawn will sentence him because this whole case, which was about him writing down something in a book no one ever saw, it was in a book that stayed on the shelf at Trump Tower, didn't have the right thing. It didn't say hush money to Stormy Daniels. It said law legal services. No one ever saw that. Just someone came knocking because they wanted to mess with Trump, found it, and said this isn't recorded accurately. It's a fraud, and he got prosecuted. And I think judge Marchand and has allowed Alvin Bragg to turn it into, you tried to steal the election because now, guys, I'm sorry to tell you, but if you ever wanna run for office, you have an ethical obligation to let any woman accusing you of any bad stuff come forward and say it to everyone. And if she says, I won't hurt you publicly, whether it's true or not, if you just give me a $130,000, you may not pay her or you're gonna go to jail. So you must let yourself be blackmailed. Let someone say this stuff about you, true or not, or you're going to prison. That's how that case was tried. That is now the position that every politician is in, theoretically. I mean, Jason Calacanis (00:25:42): the the case made sense as a misdemeanor, but not as a felony. I think David Friedberg (00:25:45): you would agree. Megyn Kelly (00:25:45): No sense. As a misdemeanor, the statute of limitations had expired. Jason Calacanis (00:25:48): Sure. But I mean, it clearly was escalated to a point, but I wonder how you think as with family members, you know, in the, you know, that are cops, how you look at the other cases, and if you think there's any validity to them. Because there are 5 cases we're talking about. He's guilty of the first three so far out of 3. Some of them feel trumped up. But what about the last 2? You know, the the documents and the January 6th one, do you think there's any validity to them? Megyn Kelly (00:26:13): No. No validity. The only the only thing that Trump was potentially in trouble on and the thing I hit him on when we interviewed was not turning over the documents once he had a subpoena. Jason Calacanis (00:26:22): Which would have been so easy to do. Yes. But Which was dumb, but he's Trump. He he should've He does over. Over. But he does self destructive stuff. Megyn Kelly (00:26:27): But that one's gone away now too because of Jack Smith not being properly appointed down there. But in answer to your question on on judge Marshawn, I think, the he he almost is in a position where he might have to sentence into jail given how big they've tried to make it. You stole an election. You stole but it'll it would be at a suspended sentence. It would be immediately appealed, and I think Trump on appeal will win. There are so many holes in that case, so I don't think Trump will ever do one single day in jail. Jason Calacanis (00:26:53): So, Meghan, if, we look at the 5 cases, you know, 6 months from now or a year from now, let's assume all 5 of them go to trial. He's guilty of 3 so far. Speaker 3 (00:27:02): Wait. What do Megyn Kelly (00:27:02): you what do you mean he's guilty of 3 so far? Jason Calacanis (00:27:04): What he's been convicted of 3? Sorry. Megyn Kelly (00:27:05): What do you mean no he hasn't? Jason Calacanis (00:27:07): The The no. E. Jean E. Jean Carroll was guilty. Megyn Kelly (00:27:11): That was not a conviction. That was a civil case. Jason Calacanis (00:27:13): Oh, well, yes. So that's what I'm talking about. David Friedberg (00:27:15): So that was Okay. Megyn Kelly (00:27:15): But there's a big difference. Jason Calacanis (00:27:16): It's it's still he was convicted. He was guilty in of that, to that settlement. Mhmm. Yeah. And the Trump Organization, they're guilty there. Megyn Kelly (00:27:27): That again was still civil. Libel. Libel. Jason Calacanis (00:27:29): Yes. Of course. But we're these are the cases we're talking about. And then the third one David Friedberg (00:27:33): You don't see the lawyer. Right? Jason Calacanis (00:27:34): Yeah. Of course. And then the third one I'm just talking about the 5 cases. Yes. Some are civil, obviously, and and some some are not. Some are criminal. But if we look David Sacks (00:27:41): at 5 cases convictions. Now you're walking it back. Jason Calacanis (00:27:44): I'm not walking it back. There's 3 in which he was You should walk it back. Speaker 3 (00:27:47): Okay. I'm so glad Megan is here. Jason Calacanis (00:27:49): Of 5 Megyn Kelly (00:27:49): to 6. Jason Calacanis (00:27:50): Of them, he's either guilty or You got a bad result. Yeah. I got a bad result. There are 2 more. If he is found guilty of those 2 more, Megan, and 5 of 5, he had a bad result, way to frame it, will will you chalk all 5 up in your mind to 5 different jurisdictions, 5 different prosecutors, 5 different juries and or judges, all conspiring to get him? Megyn Kelly (00:28:16): 100%. Okay. Yes. Jason Calacanis (00:28:18): That's all I wanted to hear your answer to. 5 of 5, 5 different jurisdictions, you think it's Megyn Kelly (00:28:23): all law. Carol, they they changed the law so that she could bring a civil lawsuit against him, and she did. New York jury, New York went 87% for Joe Biden. That that that fix was in right from the start. The fraud trial that Letitia James brought against him has never been brought. There's no victims. The banks who were involved said we didn't lose a penny. What are we doing here? We weren't damaged. Nobody was complaining except Tish James who ran for office saying, I will get him. Then you have Alvin Bragg, who's a George Soros funded prosecutor who doesn't like to prosecute any crime in New York City where I live for 17 years, except if your name is Donald Trump. Let's go down to Georgia where Fannie Willis and Nathan Wade couldn't keep their libidos in check long enough to actually bring this case against Donald Trump. It's a repeat of what was happening in January 6th up in the case with judge Chutkan who loathes Trump and has sentenced almost every j six defendant to way more jail time than their counterparts would get. Those are falling apart because of presidential immunity, which was handed down by the Supreme Court who said, you cannot bring a criminal case against a sitting president for any official act. Those cases are have been gutted. Also, a Supreme Court ruling saying the same on January 6 defendants in general, and that leaves us with Florida and the documents. And Trump has torn that apart because Jack Smith wasn't properly appointed and isn't the right counsel, but there are other issues they haven't even gotten to presidential immunity there. And so that one's going nowhere as well. And, by the way, they're gonna peel it up to the 11th Circuit. She just threw it out. The 11th Circuit is conservative, and thank god so is the current Supreme Court. They're not gonna tolerate that nonsense. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:29:48): Let me ask you about David Sacks (00:29:54): I think Let me I think Jay Kow I think Jay Kow just lost his right to ever bring up lawfare again. Jason Calacanis (00:30:01): No. We're here. We're here. David Sacks (00:30:02): We're here. We're here. It's over. Jason Calacanis (00:30:04): I didn't give we're not here to hear my opinion. I didn't give my opinion. I wanted Meg. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:30:09): Let's let's, Jason Calacanis (00:30:10): that's my job as my Chamath Palihapitiya (00:30:11): Democratic party and the Republican party 2028 post all of this. Okay? I suspect because of your influence, I I So tell me if this is not even true, but up and coming folks are probably trying to meet you all the time because they wanna build a relationship, build a rapport so that when it's time for them to get, you know, interviewed or whatever, there's a so you must see a lot of people. Just give us a state of politicians post this current batch. What is the same I don't Megyn Kelly (00:30:42): feel very optimistic. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:30:43): Okay. Is it getting worse? Megyn Kelly (00:30:45): Yeah. It's getting worse because of Instagram and AOC, that kind of person. Yes. Her specifically, but not just her. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:30:54): Say more. Megyn Kelly (00:30:55): They they they want these are congressional Kardashians. Can I tell you something? My experience in the news business dealing with politicians leads me to believe that the people in this room and on this stage over your 2 day conference are the people we need to be looking to for our future leaders and ideas and to save the country. It it's not Washington DC. All the incentives to be a good person are gone. It's not that there aren't any good ones. There's there definitely are, and there's some, you know, true patriots who are still trying to serve and even Who are true people? Chamath Palihapitiya (00:31:32): Just one on either side that you would just tell us to look out for or even they are already doing the job where you say these two people are, like, good people. Megyn Kelly (00:31:44): You should play the little Jeopardy music right now. No one's coming to mind off the top of my head, but I know that there are some. Look. I like Rand Paul. Okay. I think Rand Paul is a good and honest man. David Friedberg (00:31:58): Don't run a giant deficit. It's not a bad boy. Megyn Kelly (00:32:00): I mean, all of them lie, so I'm not trying to excuse all of that. They all do. But if you watch people long enough, you find the ones that stand up for the right issues and seem to have some integrity. That's one that comes to mind. I there used to be a day where they where they would reach across the aisle, and they actually weren't just there for clicks or to make themselves famous or and those days are few and far between now. I just think with look. I supported the Supreme Court's decision in Citizen United, and I think big money in politics was always gonna happen, but it's corrupted the system in a way that, you know, most politicians only have to answer to their one group of big donors or their one small constituency in their one very red or very blue town. And there's no more incentive to compromise. There's only incentive to get reelected, which is one of the frustrations we have when we watch Washington. Nothing gets done or a sighs of relief in this congress where we watch Washington and nothing gets done. Right? Right now, I'm all about going back to the original founding version of this country where government was as small as possible. Yeah. The presidency was as small as possible, and these people do as little as humanly possible rather than David Friedberg (00:33:10): I feel, Megan, I feel like someone should do, like, a modern day recap of the Federalist Papers. Like, an understanding of the basis of the foundation of the Republic. Like, where what were the founding philosophies and how and then understanding how far astray we've we've gone. But let me ask you a question. What constitutional amendments would you pass to fix the incentive problems? If you could have your brothers pass any constitutional amendment or 2, what would they be to address the incentive issue that's causing a lot of the integrity and misaligning clause? Megyn Kelly (00:33:42): I don't think it it starts like that. I think it it is just like Kamala Harris's choice as Biden's, replacement. It's bottom up. It's bottom up. That's the lie. Remember they told Jason Calacanis (00:33:52): us Chuck Schumer is bottom up. We chose the Megyn Kelly (00:33:54): people chose her. Literally, nobody's voted for her to be the nominee. I think this one does have to be bottom up. Like, if we're gonna change the way we elect politicians and the way we govern ourselves, you know, we're so it's so much more complex than just what what laws are written down. And you tech has a lot to do with it, how divided we are, how disconnected we are, how lonely we are. I mean, right now, the latest strain of the argument is interesting, which is all the processed foods are making us weird and unhealthy and dying and and dividing people further because it's driving our hormones nuts, and our behavior is getting weirder. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:34:32): And obese. Megyn Kelly (00:34:33): Yeah. And obesity. So, I mean, there's just a lot we need to reconsider about the way we're living. Jason Calacanis (00:34:39): And I do think one of Megyn Kelly (00:34:40): the main things is we need to see each other again. We need to, like, look at each at each other in the eye across from the table. We need to ban our kids from playing on the devices when they get together for play dates. We must insist that they play outside without any devices and actually connect with nature. We must make sure that they do the same. We must get out of the coastal cities and go to fly over country and go to a rodeo in Montana, something like that. You know? I like, we all we have have to start loving our country again. That's a huge piece of it. And that again is community. You know? Speaking of rodeo in Montana, we went we go out there. We have a little ski cabin there, which we love. And, we went in the summer, brought our kids to a rodeo. They started playing the national anthem, and my little guy at the time was, like, 5. And he was a little slow to get up. Right? Like, he knows to get up, but he was, like, 5. And there's this old cowboy sitting right behind us with the big hat and the jeans and the belt, Jason Calacanis (00:35:33): and he goes, boy, you better get on your feet. And my son was like, oh, shit. Yes, sir. Megyn Kelly (00:35:40): That was me. But I was like, right on. Chamath Palihapitiya (00:35:42): Well, that's great. Megyn Kelly (00:35:43): Right on. That's what we need. Right? Like, more of that and more of looking out for one another, not with forced taxes and through the eyeballs and all that nonsense, but, like, your neighbor's sick, go make him a casserole. Your old older neighbor is housebound, go mow her lawn. That is the stuff that used to make us us. And as we just retreat into our devices and our television screens and all of it, we lose that and we lose us. Jason Calacanis (00:36:10): Alright. Well said. Ladies and gentlemen, Megyn Kelly.